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Around SBN: What If This Is It For The Celtics? End Of An Era Looming

Jordan Jefferson Presumed Guilty: QB Abandoned by Team, Coach, Tiger Fans?

Let me start with full disclosure.  The Bleacher Report has afforded me opportunities normally reserved for professional journalist, which I am not.  I have written, I have been published (both online and print media), I have been granted access to events and people I otherwise would not have but I am a construction contractor and business man by trade.  Writing and LSU Football are simple pleasures for me.

So when I say what I am about to say, it is with no pride, pleasure or particular concern for what might happen in the win/loss column of the team that I love.

The LSU Tigers are seemingly turning their back on one (two) of their own and it is beyond deplorable.

Jordan Jefferson and Josh Johns were suspended by the Tiger's Head Coach Les Miles on August 26, 2011 after being arrested by the Baton Rouge Police Department on 2nd Degree Battery charges that were the result of a bar fight that the two young men and other LSU Football players were allegedly involved in during the wee hours of August 19, 2011.

Coach Miles really had no choice in making the decision to suspend Jefferson and Johns once the arrests were made.  One could argue that he really has no choice in continuing to enforce those suspensions as the prosecution is on-going.

Therein lies the problem.  As more information has been revealed, not only about the incident but the victim's diminishing credibility it has become increasingly questionable as to whether this case will ever go to trial. 

Unfortunately however, the wheels of justice turn slowly while the blur of the 2011 college football season—Mr. Jefferson's Senior and final campaign—is in high speed and will not wait for old lady liberty to balance her scale. 

While the charges are serious, the evidence the BRPD reportedly based the charges on is anything but.

First; the initial police report names the self proclaimed victim, Andrew Lowery and a female friend of his—who was later called a third-party witness—Victoria Long as having witnessed Jefferson kick Lowery in the face and both identified Josh Johns, a third-string defensive back, as having been involved along with other LSU Football players that were recognizable but not known to them.

Lowery and Long claimed that Lowery, who was later identified as 'a marine' despite not being in uniform or on any type of official business, and who also later claimed that he arrived at the bar to pick up a friend, rushed into the mob beating of a man unknown to them to save the man from this mob.

Long claimed that this man was drug from his vehicle when he 'yelled' for another vehicle to get out of his way.

She went on to say that this man did claim to have a gun and threatened the crowd with it.

She was contacted later—at 6:10am—by the responding officer and was able to provide specific information as to Mr. Lowery's condition and whereabouts. 

Some serious questions about this account have come to light.  For example, Lowery lied about his whereabouts prior to the start of the fight.  Video obtained by the Associated Press from Shady's lounge shows Lowery being ejected from the bar just seconds prior to the altercation. 

Also, Shady’s General Manager John Peak told the Associated Press, "What we do know is that Lowery threw the first punch, that's one thing we do know and we will attest to and he had been kicked out of the bar.”

In fact, Lowery is seen on the video accosting a woman who was able to obtain a restraining order, claiming that this incident was the latest in a string of ‘stalking’ incidents that had occurred over several weeks leading up to that night.

Attorney’s for Jefferson have obtained sworn statements from witnesses claiming that lowery punched another man who was dancing with the alleged stalking victim, along with others that claim Jefferson was not involved in the altercation at all.

Adding to the diminishing credibility of Mr. Lowery is the fact that he has continued to lie to the police in other matters. 

After swinging his arm into the path of a a moving vehicle on Highland Road, while hitchhiking at 5:00am, on September 4th—after admitting to having several beers and a Lortab, a combination of acetaminophen and hydrocodone—he lied to police that the vehicle swerved into him as he was walking off to the side of the road.

His attorney, Michael P. Bienvenu—the same man representing him and the other alleged victims from the Shady's incident—say’s that this encounter (and his dishonesty) with state troopers has no bearing on the alleged attack at the bar in Tiger Town.   

Bienvenu might be right about that from a legal perspective but it certainly has a bearing on this young man's credibility and frankly that is basically all that is keeping Jordan Jefferson and Josh John's from joining their teammates. 

Jordan Jefferson nor Josh Johns have had any prior disciplinary action from LSU nor have they previously been charged with any crimes or other nefarious activity.

Lowery on the other hand has a criminal record in Florida, a restraining order in Baton Rouge and not less than ten days ago admitted to lying to police during an investigation.

At this point the legal case has to run its course but LSU and Les Miles should take the extenuating circumstances of the known facts into account. 

Jordan Jefferson has no where to go to get his career back.  Many fans and some experts feel that LSU is better off under the guidance of fellow Sr. QB Jarrett Lee, who has played well and led the Tigers to a 2-0 start in his absence but that is missing the point.

Jefferson may very well be 2-0 had he not been kicked off the team or he could have lost the job by now and Johns wasn't expected to play this year anyway but again that misses the point.

Jefferson and Johns are sidelined and essentially being presumed guilty, until proven innocent, which seems more and more likely and that is the point.

In the rush to make sure LSU Football players didn't receive an undue pass for bad behavior it appears increasingly likely that the BRPD did exactly the opposite; pressed undue charges because they are LSU Football players.

That is not the American way and it is not the way a TEAM should treat two of their own.

Jarrett Lee hasn't done anything to lose the job at this point so Jefferson may not ever start again but for him to be sitting at home shoeless and waiting for lady justice to weigh her scale is not fair and it is un-American. 

So this LSU fan, who happens to be a big fan of the Mad Hatter as well, is calling on Les Miles to make one of his patented 'risky but right' forth down with the game on the line calls.  

Reinstate Jefferson and Johns now. 

As always, there will be critics and he will be called crazy or accused of trying to win at all cost but when Jefferson and Johns are cleared the reward will be immeasurable.

Miles would not only be the best coach in Team history, he'd be the guy that stood up for his players when they were being wrongfully prosecuted despite the risk to his own reputation.

How would that play on the recruiting trail?

Make the call Coach, Geaux Tigers!

 

also posted at: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/847767-jordan-jefferson-presumed-guilty-abandoned-by-team-coach-fans-geaux-tigers

Comment 79 comments  |  2 recs  | 

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Comments

Display:

Out of curiosity

Is Jefferson still allowed to practice or travel with the team? Be in on film sessions, etc?

by Squash on Sep 14, 2011 9:54 AM CDT reply actions  

I don't like the title of this post at all.

You imply that Miles and the team have abandoned JJ (and JJ).

Otherwise, I agree. I want to see this matter settled. I think you can make that point without implicitly suggesting that they have been effectively discarded.

Jordan Jefferson ...errrr...Jarrett Lee for Heisman!

by Gregatron on Sep 14, 2011 12:37 PM CDT reply actions  

It might sound harsh but it's the harsh reality in my view.

I make it quite clear that Les did what he had to do in suspending him, and perhaps his hands are tied by the administration in reinstating but at this point, IMHO, everyday that these two guys remain suspended on these BOGUS, TRUMPED UP CHARGES, is another day they have been abandoned by their School/Coach/Team and I think one day (soon) it will be looked back on as a regret.

I also think if JJ is allowed to essentially have his career ended over what WILL PROVE TO BE BOGUS, TRUMPED UP CHARGES we (via negative recruiting) will pay a hefty price for it.

I might be Les Miles biggest fan. [My wife and I are adopting and I am to the point that I might be cut off until he graduates because I am insisting on naming him Miles Edwin Ball (cool name, I know) and my little Georgia Peach don’t like it.] But he needs to step up and end this crap. I don’t give a flying rat who starts, I love all our Tigers, and if he does start and just plain out sucks, I don’t care! He has paid his dues, he IS A TIGER and he IS BEING RAILROADED.

I no longer think this; I know it and anyone that knows the facts of the case knows it, which at this point I would assume includes Les and the AD.

Alleva should know better and it’s time to END IT.

REINSTATE THESE YOUNG MEN NOW!

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 14, 2011 1:59 PM CDT up reply actions  

I agree with some of this

I certainly agree that the evidence points to Jefferson being innocent.

However, Miles has enough to stand on simply on the fact that Jefferson lied to him about it. I don’t know if you remember the articles the day after, but Jefferson was saying things like “it’s my senior season, I wouldn’t be caught in that situation” or “I was home, we left early” or whatever (not exact quotes obviously). So as much as it sucks for Jefferson…I think if he would’ve told Miles from the beginning that “Hey Coach I made a dumb decision, I was caught in a bad situation but I swear I didn’t do what they said I did” rather than lying from the start and then being forced to change his story then he’d have a better shot. That way Miles could say “I trust my player” but…he can’t now, not when that player lied to him.

by Squash on Sep 15, 2011 2:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

"However, Miles has enough to stand on simply on the fact that Jefferson lied to him about it"

Please back this up. Where are you getting that from?

The only statement that was ever attributed to Jordan was when he told his father that he wasn’t INVOLVED in a fight, he knew better and had too much to lose.

His father was asked his whereabouts, at that point in time, and he said he is at home.

Unless you know something that has not been reported and can provide a credible source then were not going to just go with ‘the fact’ that he lied to his coach because its not a fact.

Please stop spreading malicious rumors about the young man. Thanks so much.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 15, 2011 6:22 AM CDT up reply actions  

Here, I'll do it.

You say “the only statement that was ever attributed to Jordan was when he told his father that he wasn’t INVOLVED in a fight.” Here are quotes from the Times-Picayune where he is attributed with quotes saying he didn’t know anything about a fight, then that he left before the fight started.

On August 19,
“He said he didn’t know anything about a fight,” John Jefferson said. "He told me ’I’ve been here four years, and I know it ain’t worth it. When I see something going down, I leave. I have too much to lose for that.’ "
http://www.nola.com/lsu/index.ssf/2011/08/lsu_quarterback_jefferson_impl.html

On August 20,
Jefferson’s father, John Jefferson, said his son told him he left before the fight started and is upset at the perception he was involved. He said Jordan Jefferson told him several teammates have vouched for his innocence, unsolicited, to Miles. He said Jefferson was in his apartment when teammates called and asked him to join a group of players who had gone out.
“Jordan said he went over there for about 30 minutes in his jeans and slippers,” John Jefferson said. “He said he saw an altercation about to happen and told the guys with him ’Let’s roll.’
”http://www.nola.com/lsu/index.ssf/2011/08/jefferson_among_lsu_players_su.html" target="_blank">http://www.nola.com/lsu/index.ssf/2011/08/jefferson_among_lsu_players_su.html

So I think it’s a little unfair to say he’s spreading malicious rumors.

by chinesebandit on Sep 15, 2011 9:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

Gee, thanks for proving my point.

Or did I miss the press conference where John Jefferson was named head coach of the LSU Football Tigers?

Jefferson told his dad he wasn’t involved, said when it started he tried to get his guys to leave and he left. That is consistent with what Jefferson and other players told police, it is consistent with what players supposedly told Miles and it is consistent with what numerous Third-Party and SOBER witnesses have sworn via affidavit and it is consistent with what Jefferson and Johns attorneys have adamantly stated to be the case.

So even if you think they are all lying please refer me to the point where ‘Jordan Jefferson Lied to Les Miles’…

Again, please stop perpetuating MALICOUS and FALSE RUMORS about this young man who has NEVER been in trouble prior to this incident and was without question FALSLEY ACCUSED by a man who has been convicted of theft, is a known stalker and has been proven to have lied to both the BRPD and LS Troopers in two separate investigations where he claims to be a victim but was at fault in both cases.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 15, 2011 3:02 PM CDT up reply actions  

From the same article

…he was first alerted to the matter this morning when LSU Coach Les Miles’ office called because it could not reach Jordan by phone. Jefferson called Jordan, who was sleeping but returned the call 30 minutes later, John Jefferson said.
 “He said he didn’t know anything about a fight,”

If he told Miles he didn’t know anything about a fight…and then even if when the fight started he DID say “let’s roll”….that’s still lying.

And seriously dude, you need to calm down. Haha I’m citing newspaper articles, not trying to “spread malicious and false rumors.” You hurt your credibility when you absolutely refuse to entertain an even SLIGHTLY different view than yours, and just resort to relentlessly attacking. You seriously do that just about every other post you make. I do NOT hate Jordan Jefferson, I DO think he is innocent, I am NOT some racist which would probably have been your next insult, and I was agreeing with your overall point that he is innocent and this sucks for him.

That being said, I think it’s pretty clear he lied to Miles from the quotes. If you disagree, I’m sure you can tell me so without accusing me of trying to hurt Jefferson by spreading rumors, cause that’s the last thing I want to do. Thanks so much.

by Squash on Sep 15, 2011 3:21 PM CDT up reply actions  

Les Miles' OFFICE (i.e. an admin assistant) calling Jordan's Dad to locate him

and Jordan telling his dad he left the scene when the fight started, which is completely consistent with what has been reported and sworn to by numerous witnesses is FAR FROM LYING TO LES MILES.

You are saying definitively that Jefferson Lied to his coach when there is NO EVIDENCE of that.

You can spin it as the media tried to do early on but the facts are what the facts are and what Jordan told his dad “I know better, I have too much to lose, I told the guys ’let’s roll’ and I left” is VERY PLAUSIBLE and is backed up by numerous sources.

You are now the second person to call me a race baiter when I have NEVER mentioned race, nor did I attack you. I told you to stop spreading rumors and unless you can produce a credible quote that shows that Jordan Jefferson LIED to Les Miles, you are spreading malicious rumors. FACT.
.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 15, 2011 4:22 PM CDT up reply actions  

And you KNOW it was an administrative assistant?

It just comes down to us having different interpretations. Personally I think if your starting quarterback is involved in a bar fight, the odds are the head coach is calling to ask about it, not some secretary. But regardless, I’m not spreading rumors, cause Jefferson lied to Miles’ “office.” FACT. We just interpret what that means differently…and I could be wrong, but I think mine is the more likely. In which case by your definition YOU would be spreading “malicious rumors.”

Citing a newspaper article is NOT spreading rumors. Sorry.

by Squash on Sep 15, 2011 8:33 PM CDT up reply actions  

It's not interpretation

Miles did not call, that’s why they said Mile’s office.

When the media quotes the president the say “Obama said” when they quote and Aide they say “The Obama Administration Said” there is a difference and you know it.

Moreover, what he said was not a lie, unless you know for a fact he is guilty. He may not have explained it to his father in full detail, when his dad woke him up and caught him off guard but he certainly didn’t tell his dad that he was at home in bed.

He told his dad that he knew better than to get involved; encouraged his guys to bounce and then he rolled out.

According to numerous witnesses that is exactly what he did.

So again, YOU ARE SPREADING RUMORS because you are SPINNING a newspaper article not simply quoting it.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 15, 2011 10:32 PM CDT up reply actions  

I would have to have an agenda to be SPINNING an article

Which I don’t. And again, WHY would some secretary call Jefferson?? They wouldn’t. A starting quarterback is important enough that the head coach would be making the call.

Look, I like Jefferson a lot. But he clearly lied here at the beginning (which to be honest, is pretty common with people at the beginning of trouble, if they think they can get out of it or are just scared). Saying he didn’t know anything about the fight is a lie, because the witnesses YOU KEEP BRINGING UP said that during the fight he just stood back and wasn’t involved.

I don’t know why you’re making this out to be such a big deal, I’m just saying that Miles does have SOME reason to be able to suspend JJ and keep him suspended…but I think the punishment time should be over very soon now.

by Squash on Sep 15, 2011 10:43 PM CDT up reply actions  

Squash

Miles’ office called to locate does not equate to MILES called him.

It just doesn’t.

There is NO evidence that Jefferson lied to Miles, to say otherwise is either ignorant or the product of an agenda.

I don’t believe you are the former and you say you don’t have the latter so something is not right with this picture.

Also, you are spinning again to say that JJ told his dad he didn’t “know anything”, he told his father he knew better than to get involved. He told his father he was there when it started, told his guys “let’s roll” and then he left.

Moreover, those are second hand quotes from his father who was likely being bombarded with accusations about how his son was an out of control animal who single handedly kicked the living crap out of a helpless band of wounded warriors so he may not have answered every question with a handle on the exact details because frankly, at that point nobody really knew what all really went down.

But you just simply have NO basis to parlay that into “Jefferson lied to Miles”, sorry.

Miles can keep him suspended based on school policy, I just don’t think he should.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 15, 2011 11:17 PM CDT up reply actions  

Oh ok

Now I see where we’re getting confused. You say that Miles’ office called to locate him….I can definitely believe that. My assumption on the other hand, was that Miles’ office called to hear his side of the story and what happened, in which case I would find it hard to believe that anyone other than Miles himself called. I guess it just depends which was the case, but honestly would it really surprise you if Jefferson DID lie to Miles in his initial meeting with him? I mean I know it’s human nature sometimes to think you can lie your way out of something at the beginning (although if I were saying what I said based solely off of that then you’d be right, and I WOULD be spreading rumors).

by Squash on Sep 16, 2011 12:19 AM CDT up reply actions  

Squash

No offense but it’s not “we” who are getting confused.

I was correct and you were spreading false rumors. I take it you are no longer confused and will discontinue such unsavory behavior. :-)

Don’t know if you saw my latest article but Jefferson’s attorneys have obtained TWENTY FIVE sworn statements corroborating just what Jordan told his father. He had nothing to do with the fight.

Please tell me again why he is suspended?

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 17, 2011 5:51 AM CDT up reply actions  

Haha we just can't agree

He lied to Miles, he lied to Miles’ office, it doesn’t matter, he lied. I don’t believe he did what he’s accused of, but he LIED to the coach. That’s enough grounds for suspension.

by Squash on Sep 18, 2011 6:39 PM CDT up reply actions  

WHERE is the LIE?

If he said he was there but not involved and only tried to get some of his guys out of the melee then bounced, which TWENTY-FIVE people now confirm then WHERE IS THE LIE?

If you want to point to the line “reported” where his dad said ‘he didn’t know anything about it’, keep in mind that was followed up in the same call with what I pointed out above so his meaning was obvious that he didn’t know anything about the fight, why the fight, etc…

THERE IS NO EVIDENCE WHATSOEVER that Jefferson lied to his coach or anybody else so you are just refusing to accept that you were wrong and now you continue to FALSLEY ACCUSE the young man so you can justify his continuing suspension.

Let me apologize to the many good, decent and rational LSU fans (not you Squash) that permeate this board for what I am about to type.

LSU fans are the WORST fan base on the planet. We suck, we eat our own, we’d rather a young man go to Angola KNOWING he has been falsely accused just because we THINK the other guy would be better on the field.

To any Tiger fan that is OK with this in any shape or form, I hope (I really do) you one day find yourself falsely accused of a violent crime you didn’t commit. Remember this then, you deserve to go to prison and to get anally raped not because of what you did (or didn’t do) but because there is someone better than you at something, have a great day.

Oh and what a favor we are doing for Nick Saban. "Yes Johnny, LSU is a fine school and I wouldn’t blame you for wanting to go there. Can you believe what happened to that Jefferson kid though? Go to the rant.com and type in Jefferson to see how the fans treat their own, I ‘know’ from first-hand experience but let me promise you this, if you ever find yourself falsely accused of a crime in Tuscaloosa, you will not be thrown aside by me and the team while a bungling police department tries to figure out how to save face, just saying"

"What’s that?"

"Sure Johnny, you can use my head as a clipboard to sign your LOI."

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 19, 2011 6:17 AM CDT up reply actions  

Speaking of rants...

Calm down. First of all, you’re delusional. What the heck does your second paragraph mean? Yes, that’s EXACTLY the quote I’m referencing. When he says “I don’t know anything about the fight” to Les Miles OR Les Miles’ office, WHICH IS CALLING ON HIS BEHALF, that’s lying to the coach. Especially when your own new article talks about him trying to break up the fight….how can he break up a fight he doesn’t know about? Therefore, he’s lying. Pretty simple logic. Not falsely accusing. You’re wrong.

Secondly, contrary to what you believe, I don’t believe you are the spokesman for the LSU fan base. You’re ripping on the team and the coach, yet say OTHER LSU fans are bad? Also, what purpose does ripping on your own fan base serve? This self righteous, holier-than-thou attitude couldn’t be more annoying. Especially from someone saying they hope other people get anal raped…yeah there’s a classy person right there.

Thirdly, notice how the posters who have been here the longest and post the most ignore your little fan-shots promoting your sensationalist journalism? Again, I don’t think you speak for everyone. You’re way too delusional and extreme, and incapable of competent and rational analysis.

by Squash on Sep 19, 2011 11:36 AM CDT up reply actions   1 recs

1st, I'm not uncalm

2nd – This is one call we are talking about here, not multiple. I can’t help it if it was fully reported in separate articles but the quotes where made at the same time.

John Jefferson basically said “Jordan doesn’t know anything about the fight and it would really surprise me if it did, he really is not like that. His teammates called him and asked him to join them at the bar, he went there for about 30 minutes and saw an altercation breaking out, he tried to get some of his teammates to clear out and he left.”

So the first article quoted above isolates the “doesn’t know anything about it” and you run with that.

Which is actually understandable since at the time you only had the partial quote as reported. However, now that you have (via several follow up articles that contain the ENTIRE quote) the whole statement in context it is disingenuous and malicious to continue to act as if Jordan Jefferson LIED to anyone.

That simply is not the case and trying to hurt my wittle fweelings by telling me nobody likes me isn’t going to change it.

And please tell me again how it is classy for our fan base to be rooting for our QB to go to prison because they like the back up better?

And yes, the Saban example is perfect – if you don’t think other coaches will use this incident, especially when it comes out that JJ was innocent, which it will, to negative sell our program then you are licking the window pane.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 19, 2011 2:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

If that's you calm...

then you’re more delusional and extreme than I could’ve imagined.

What “full quote” are you talking about? I’m the only one who’s referencing a link here, if you gave some maybe that would help.

Don’t remember trying to hurt your feelings or say nobody likes you…but whatever.

I have NOWHERE seen any LSU fan hope that Jefferson “gets sent to Angola,” regardless of whether or not they think Lee will perform better on the field. And here you go off ranting about the entire fan base when I’ve yet to see a single person here say anything about that.

For the last time, I SUPPORT Jefferson. Unlike you, I also support Les Miles and his decision-making. I think he MAY just be a LITTLE bit more in touch with the situation than you are. He’s handled just about every decision I can think of extremely well in the past, so I’m not going to accuse him of “abandoning” Jefferson just because I disagree.

by Squash on Sep 20, 2011 1:03 AM CDT up reply actions  

I'd like to point out how impotant grammsar is fo such and impotant posta like you self....

If you don’t think people have been cheering for the worst and hoping JJ’s involvement would lead to his permanent removal from the team, which would be up to a FIVE year prison term, if convicted then again, stay away from the window pane!

And good luck convincing anyone on this site that I have some sort of anti-Les Miles agenda.

Have a Great Day!

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 20, 2011 5:56 AM CDT up reply actions  

Southern Man's method of -winning- losing an argument

1. Make a non-sensical comment about grammar to ignore claims.

2. Ignore requests for links backing up his claims.

3. Accuse me of ignorance without saying why.

I told you, I have not SEEN ANY LSU fans hoping Jefferson gets sent to prison. Maybe there are some, but that doesn’t reflect on the whole fan base, all teams have crazy people as fans.

“Good luck convincing anyone on this site that I have some sort of anti-Les Miles agenda.” Last I checked, you are the only one accusing him of abandoning his quarterback.

by Squash on Sep 20, 2011 11:50 AM CDT up reply actions  

Guess strikethrough doesn't work in the subject line

Should’ve read “of winning losing an argument”

by Squash on Sep 20, 2011 11:52 AM CDT up reply actions  

Southern Man's method of -winning- losing an argument

1. Learned directly from Squash
2. Ignore request for links ALREADY present in chain
3. Point out obvious ignorance, no need to elaborate.

I didn’t say all fans wanted him to go to prison but we ALL know there are MANY more than a few. Just as more than a few, like yourself, continue to forward BASELESS and unfounded rumors and lies to fit your agendas.

And please go back and read the article, not just the headline, I made it clear that Miles had no choice in suspending him and you could make the argument that his hands are still tied but I called on him to make one of his famous, ballsy, nobody saw that coming yet it was exactly the right thing to do calls and reinstate.

At this point I’m sure he’ll wait on the GJ but I’m more convinced than ever that JJ and JJ should have NEVER been arrested and these charges are a joke!

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 21, 2011 7:50 PM CDT up reply actions  

Haha you are unbelievable

1. I corrected your spelling. You made a comment out of nowhere about grammar when there wasn’t anything to correct, or any relevance whatsoever.

2. There is one link in the chain, and it was the article chinesebandit posted supporting MY argument. Are you really this dumb?

3. “Point out obvious ignorance, no need to elaborate.” Surprised you got that sentence out without misspelling every other word, and it’s ironic coming from someone whose sentences include such gems as “I quite happy” and “know ideal.”

SouthernMan, I have not seen ANY fans here, HERE (for the 10th time) that want JJ to go to prison. If you’re writing to fans of other sites, maybe WRITE ON OTHER SITES. To the intended audience. Novel concept.

“Please go back and read the article, not just the headline.” Hahaha YOU wrote the headline too! If it was so “clear” that Miles had no choice suspending him then why are you posting a headline accusing him of ABANDONING his quarterback? It’s called sensationalist journalism, and it’s pathetic.

Yes, as I’ve stated many times, I agree that neither JJ should’ve been arrested.

by Squash on Sep 22, 2011 2:26 AM CDT up reply actions  

I know - it's all me

1. You lectured me and continue to do so over not proofreading every blog-post, get a life.

2. You apparently can’t count either, there are two links on the same post that give more detail of one conversation that you want to isolate one comment from. Bottom line, YOU ARE WRONG but can’t admit it.

3. Again, the hypocrisy is amusing

The article was posted on Bleacher Report and I linked it here, someone also posted it on the rant, I was contacted by an Alumni group who featured it on their site and the Baton Rouge Business Report picked it up and carried it. (there may be others, not sure)

So yes, it was written to a wide audience but you have kept it going for a while now, with your inability to say you were wrong (or better yet, take the out I gave you and say you were mislead, since the first report by itself was misleading, kind of like the first report of a wild band of football players violently attacking a returning war hero) and move on.

Yes, as I’ve stated many times, I agree that neither JJ should’ve been arrested

Nor did he lie to Coach Miles.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 22, 2011 6:23 AM CDT up reply actions  

Yup, it's you

1. When you are saying things like this: “You have know ideal that JJ wouldn’t be doing just as well as JLee or better, Lee is doing well, i quite happy but let’s not act like its something its not” then you look like an absolute IDIOT. Let’s not me getting a life, it’s you learning how to sound like a normal, credible human being.

2. I just went through our ENTIRE conversation, and the only link I can see is the one posted by chinesebandit.

3. Again, I provide examples, you just ignorantly put something out there with no examples.

And I’m not talking about he article, the article was fine here, but when you REPEATEDLY in your comments attack the LSU fan base (and the people you’re attacking aren’t here), it gets old and ridiculous really fast. I don’t go to the rant, so I don’t know what goes on there, and if the fan base bothers you so much maybe you shouldn’t go there either, cause I’m fine with the fan base that I’ve seen here.

I wasn’t wrong. Jefferson lied. I guess I have to number this.

4. WHICH article shows that Jefferson didn’t lie?

5. Also, since you conveniently ignored this: “I made it clear Miles had no choice in suspending him.” Then WHY did you accuse Miles of “abandoning” Jefferson? That’s irresponsible, and a cheap way to try and get attention for your article.

YOU won’t admit you’re wrong, I gave YOU an out when I said that maybe we had different interpretations of that first report (and you have yet to link to an updated report of that day/incident), but you wouldn’t take it.

by Squash on Sep 22, 2011 9:14 AM CDT up reply actions  

1. Iorny of continuing to berate me on my writing ability and concluding it with this

Let’s not me getting a life

Gee, humans make mistakes, who knew?

I just went through our ENTIRE conversation, and the only link I can see is the one posted by chinesebandit.

Except that there are two links in the same post by Chinese Bandit.

Count much?

3. Don’t need to explain, all can see.

4. Reading comprehension, simple deductive reasoning? “I don’t know anything about that – I LEFT shortly after it started” DOES NOT equate to “Daddy, I wasn’t ever there, pinky swear, tell that to Coach Miles (or his office) please”

5. Where did I accuse Miles of Abandoning JJ? It seems to me that the presence of a question mark at the end of the QUESTION posed by the headline indicates that it was a QUESTION. One answered, one might deduce, by the statement "Miles had no choice in suspending the JJs and one could argue his hands are STILL tied?

Read much?

I will not admit to being wrong because I am not. You have NO EVIDENCE that Jefferson Lied to anyone, just some conjecture you’ve extrapolated from a partial quote from an early and again INCOMPLETE account of a conversation with an assistant and Jefferson’s father. To continue putting it forward as fact is just obtuse and asinine but continue on sport.

And Have A Great Day!

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 22, 2011 10:41 AM CDT up reply actions  

1. Should’ve read *that’s not…". I made one mistake, that’s ok, I admitted it, and you still outnumber mine 4 to 1.

2. Did you bother trying those links? THEY DON’T WORK. It’s inconceivable that you’re really this thick.

3. Continue to impress with your debating skills and intelligence. You’ll win a lot of debates with that argument. Good thinking.

4. Yes, simple reading comprehension will definitely help you here. Telling Miles OR his office that he “didn’t know anything about the fight” is lying. If he left shortly after the fight started…then he must have known about it, right? I never said he stuck to his story the whole time, I said initially he lied, and that’s what got him in trouble. Obviously he can change it later, but that doesn’t make the earlier quote untrue.

5. Dumbest thing I’ve ever heard. That’s an accusation, regardless of a question mark. And if THAT one isn’t good enough for you, how about your bolded statement, “The LSU Tigers are seemingly turning their back on one (two) of their own and it is beyond deplorable.” Haha is that good enough for you? The LSU TIGERS. Not the fans. The Tigers. That would mean the team and the coach.

Let me know when you’re wrong. Or you can keep trying to argue and just provide more evidence of you contradicting yourself.

by Squash on Sep 22, 2011 11:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

cut and paste partner. - but you know that.

And I do think it is deplorable that the JJs are still suspended, again that’s probably not in Miles’ hands right now but I would sure like to see him stick his neck out for these guys and reinstate them now instead of waiting for it to play out in the courts.

Either way, I trust that Miles will do the right thing and I’m confident he knows more about the situation internally than I ever will.

Thanks for giving so much airtime to my article by the way, much appreciated!

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 22, 2011 11:59 AM CDT up reply actions  

Cut and paste the links

be my guest. They don’t work. They don’t work as one link, they don’t work as two links.

by Squash on Sep 22, 2011 12:25 PM CDT up reply actions  

And way to dodge

the fact that you MALICIOUSLY accused the LSU team of turning their back on JJ! Oh my gosh! You must have an agenda to spread such horrible rumors!

by Squash on Sep 22, 2011 12:26 PM CDT up reply actions  

It's not a dodge

I published my opinion, not hiding it from anyone.

I think it is a travesty what has happened to the JJs and specifically to Jefferson since he can’t really get it back and If Les has the power to overturn the suspension he absolutely should.

Some fans are just pathetic human beings and life will have a way of proving that to them.

Key word being some, if you think it applies to you then it probably does.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 22, 2011 1:00 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well most of it is posted in the comment by Chinese Bandidt

not just the link.

Nonetheless, I cut and pasted it into my browser and had no problem so whatever.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 22, 2011 12:56 PM CDT up reply actions  

Hmm

Ok well I cut and pasted and it said page not available…then I cut and pasted it as one link and it went to the NOLA site but said it couldn’t find the page.

I agree that anyone who is happy that Jefferson got arrested so they don’t have to watch him play anymore is a joke.

I’m not saying I agree with Miles or disagree, I’m just saying what he did is defensible. Hopefully, JJ will be back on the team soon though.

by Squash on Sep 22, 2011 1:06 PM CDT up reply actions  

And the Saban example

is stupid. You don’t think other fans have message boards and psychos? Harvey Updike? Saban cutting players? EVERY school has negative things that are used against them in recruiting, if you think this will make a difference…that’s just stupid.

by Squash on Sep 19, 2011 11:37 AM CDT up reply actions  

I don't agree with this at all.

there are two things that could happen here. The JJ’s are found guilty, where Miles would be grilled beyond belief for letting them continue to play. Or they could be found innocent. In this case, they have already missed 2 games and 3 weeks of practice, not to mention would still have to divert their attention from the team and the game so that they can get to the innocent verdict (or charges dropped). Reinstating them now would burn a year of their eligibility (Jefferson’s last year) during a time period where they could hardly dedicate themselves to the game fully.

By Keeping them away from the team Miles is not only sparing the team from a huge distraction, but sparing this entire year of eligibility for each player. If they are found innocent or the charges are dropped they could appeal the NCAA for an additional year when they will be able to get back to focusing on football. If I was Jefferson, I would rather have to sit out a full year and come back the next year than have to half ass a half a season. What Les is doing is giving them a chance to redeem themselves fully.

Get your accusatory head out of your ass. Despite what Bleacher Report and ESPN may tell you, Les Miles is not a dumb man. There is a reason he is paid more than you to make these decisions.

"It's not all about the game. It's about who you share it with." - Les Miles

by Matt 'n' The Hat on Sep 14, 2011 1:53 PM CDT reply actions   1 recs

They WILL NOT BE FOUND GUILTY - Book it.

This is JJ’s final year, period. He wouldn’t have to apply for a red-shirt, he has five to play four, however, he has already graduated and it might be even more of a distraction for him to return next year.

Since RS has missed the same amount of time should we hold him out all year?

And, if you can find one reference in article or comment that I’ve EVER POSTED on ANY SITE on ANY PLANET that indicates that I believe or have implied that Les Miles is a dumb man I’ll send you my autographed #18 Jacob Hester Jersey.

You OBVIOUSLY just read the title and not the article so stick your condescending conclusion jumping head back up your own back side or kiss mine, either way.

Have a great day!

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 14, 2011 2:07 PM CDT reply actions  

AGREE WHOLEHEARTEDLY WITH THE SENTIMENT

 Just a couple of observations

FIRST, I question WHY “Coach Miles really had no choice in making the decision to suspend Jefferson and Johns once the arrests were made.” Because it was the politically correct thing to do? Because they were already under the microscope from the “probation” and the Willie Lyles thing and couldn’t afford to take a principled stand? In other words, did JJ and Johns pay for someone else’s sins?

SECONLY, I’m not sure (and perhaps I just choose not to believe) that Miles abandoned these kids. I think the University abandoned these kids (for the reasons stated above) and Miles took his marching orders from above.

As I understand it and you have recounted, the arrest warrant was based solely on the accusations of the “marine” and the underaged girl (neither of whom, by the way, were present at Shady’s when the cops first arrived, but mysteriously appeared after the cops had left and come back).

BTR has an unbelievable homicide and unsolved crime rate, but that doesn’t get you on ESPN. The police chief was enjoying his 15 mins.

We live in a country where a person is innocent until proven guilty. Yet, because of the practical ramifications of the arrest – AND LSU’S POLITICALLY CORRECT RESPONSE TO THE ARREST – on JJ’s future, the BRPD effectively acted as judge, jury and executioner and did so, it appears, solely on the basis of the affidavits of some opportunistic punk and a girl who had no business being in a bar parking lot @ 2:00 am anyway.

I have no doubt that this case will be eviscerated at or before trial. Unfortunately, as you point out, it will be too late for JJ. The kid needed this year to show his future employers – pro scouts – what he could really do on a high profile national stage. He will no longer have that opportunity unless LSU steps up and does the right thing. Reinstate him until such time as he is PROVEN guilty.

I expect as much from the police; especially a PD trying to distract the public’s attention from the horrendous job it does day in and day out. I am very disappointed that an institution of higher learning has exhibited such cowardice and more interest in covering its own backside politically than doing the right thing.

by Deluded on Sep 14, 2011 3:24 PM CDT reply actions  

JEFFERSON AND JOHNS SHOULD BE REINSTATED

Jefferson and Johns should be immediately reinstated to the LSU football team by Coach Les Miles, if for no other reason than to give substance to the principle that the accused in a criminal case must be presumed innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt in a court of law. To simply give lip service to this most important principle of our criminal justice system is simply wrong. Personally, I believe the time for Coach Miles to take action against Jefferson and Johns is only after they’ve been found guilty of the accusations against them. If that never occurs, then no one is hurt by the immediate reinstatement of Jefferson and Johns. However, as things now stand, two young men are being punished for an alleged crime that no court of law has found them guilty of committing and that a number of disinterested witnesses say they did not do. What has happened so far to Jefferson and Johns is the very definition of injustice, which is something we must all strive to rid from our society lest we find ourselves to be the next person punished before being found guilty of any crime.

by Caliguy55 on Sep 15, 2011 11:17 PM CDT reply actions  

The reason these argument are fallacious...

is they fail to take into consideration the unfortunate and inescapable fact that the BRPD, as the local law authority, has spoken on the matter, however suspicious the circumstances appear. While the circumstances surrounding this case and its victims are indeed, suspect, unless the DA intervenes, which they are not, then LSU, Coach Miles and his team can do nothing about the case and they have no choice but to await the results of the investigation. Unfortunately, innocent until proven guilty does not apply to NCAA rules. To accuse Coach Miles of turning his back on JJ is absurd. He has a responsibility to his university, his team and the other players. He doesn’t have time to become an activist. Bloggers on this site, however, might themselves have time to direct their passions into writing letters pleading the case to the DA’s office. Since many here believe that a travesty of justice has occurred and evidence exists that supports Jefferson’s and John’s innocence, why not channel all this rage into a focused, organized movement on the arrested player’s behalf? Call state reps and council members, start a petition, find a publicist to help spread the word. If the evidence truly supports the case, then contact anyone of weight to help champion the cause. But first consider on whose behalf are you advocating and why—-yours, as LSU fans, or that of two innocent young men? Which ever the answer, be consistent in your arguments or you will have no cause.

by SeaTiger on Sep 16, 2011 8:51 AM CDT reply actions  

IF . . .

 . . . . “SeaTiger” is correct that " Miles . . . [has] no choice but to await the results of the investigation," then I would agree that these arguments are potentially fallacious. But first some questions and comments.

For starters, I want to reiterate that I don’t think it was Miles’ choice, but rather the university’s.

QUESTION: SeaTiger, are you confident that a mere arrest – regardless of how specious the grounds – triggers some sort of mandatory suspension by the NCAA? I have not heard that either the NCAA or its rules mandated the suspension. IF you are aware of such a mandate, then you are right. However, if there is no such mandate, then it seems to me that YOUR argument is fallacious in that it then rests primarily on the judgment of the BRPD as “the local law authority.” I’m sorry, but i can not agree that these kids – or anyone, for that matter – should suffer irreversible consequences because some undereducated pinheads in a police dept marked mostly by its incompetence decide to issue arrest warrants which, ON THEIR FACE, demonstrate incompetence.

Your recommendation that posters write and/or call state reps. and council members is misguided. Just as the law should not operate to convict and punish without due process and a trial, it should not be influenced by political considerations (although having grown up in La., I know that’s how it often works). It would be a public relations fiasco if these kids were reinstated because of political maneuvering of any kind.

I think that, absent an NCAA mandate requiring their suspension, the kids should be reinstated because they are innocent until proven guilty and the BRPD should not effectively be allowed to ruin a kid’s life – which is exactly what’s happening to Jefferson right now – simply because it chose to issue arrest warrants. Do you know how easy it is to get an arrest warrant issued (if you didn’t before, you should now)?

I think that, to the extent Miles had no choice, it’s because the UNIVERSITY gave him no choice, and that the UNIVERSITY gave him no choice because: (a) it wouldn’t be the politically correct thing to do in the current NCAA climate; and, (b) the University, already under the microscope for other allged misdeeds, can’t afford even a whiff of a scandal, so all it took was a pathetic investigation by a pathetic police department led by a Police Chief who couldn’t wait to get his 15 minutes and otherwise distract attention to what a poor job his dept. is doing. In other words, Jefferson & Johns are paying a heavy price for someone else’s screw ups.

And for context, yes I am an LSU fan, but that’s not why this bothers me so much. NO ONE should suffer the consequences that Jefferson is suffering on the basis of some flimsy arrest warrant. Frankly, that kid could be one of ours or, indeed, one of us. Do you really want the police dept. determining your fate? That’s really the country you want to live in?

If it was the University which dictated this suspension, it has no stones and should be ashamed of itself. They left an innocent kid (AND YES, HE IS INNOCENT until proven otherwise) out to twist in the wind only to cover its own ass politically, knowing full well the dire consequences to Jefferson regardless of whether he is ultimately found not guilty. In other words, it allowed the BRPD, and punk kid and his blowhard attorney to push it around.

Finally, as much as I admire Les Miles as a man (and I really don’t think this is his doing), YES he does have time – just as Will Muschamp has had time – to act as an advocate on behalf of his players.

by Deluded on Sep 16, 2011 8:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

Couldn't have said it better.

To answer your question: this is not an NCAA mandated suspension. This is not an eligibility issue.

LSU has a policy that dictated the suspension, but I’m not sure it absolutely requires the ongoing suspension and I would think the School has the authority to allow an exception with extenuating circumstances, which certainly exist here.

Miles did what he had to do in making the suspension, IMO, and he may well be raising hell behind the scenes but he absolutely should be trying to get these guys reinstated if he doesn’t already have the power to do so.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 16, 2011 8:51 PM CDT up reply actions  

AS MUCH STROKE . . .

 . . . as Les probably has given his contribution to the University’s bottom line, there are some things which I suspect are out of his hands, even when it comes to his “damn strong team.” If the AD, Chancellor & President tell Les “this is the way it’s going to be,” then I suspect Les’ hands are tied. I suspect that is what has happened in this case.

by Deluded on Sep 16, 2011 10:04 PM CDT up reply actions  

jefferson

I think the kids sb innocent until proven guilty. Clearly Miles would not have done this unless LSU administration forced it by policy or otherwise. BRPD and the DA should quickly resolve this one. IMO they should never have been arrested.

by mhc4bucks on Sep 17, 2011 4:30 PM CDT reply actions  

Most Tiger fans that I know and I know alot

abandoned Jordan Jefferson last season and could really care less if Jefferson is reinstated or not. I really don’t understand why this is being discussed so much when there are tons of other LSU topics to talk about. We aren’t talking about a heisman quarterback and not even the top quarterback on our team. Why is this being debated so much here? How in the world does this affect our team? None. We are much better without him starting and we actually have a passing offense with Lee. Jefferson is not accurate. All he can do is scramble around before either getting sacked or throwing the ball into coverage for a pick. I agree that he has gotten screwed with this fight altercation and I hope he gets cleared. But let him ride the bench if he is reinstated..

If you can't beat them, arrange to have them beaten-George Carlin

by AcquiredPanic on Sep 20, 2011 2:21 PM CDT reply actions  

We aren’t talking about a heisman quarterback and not even the top quarterback on our team

So the criterion to give a flying rat about one of our players is if he is heisman material?

How in the world does this affect our team?

You’ve obviously never been on one.

We are much better without him starting and we actually have a passing offense with Lee.

You have know ideal that JJ wouldn’t be doing just as well as JLee or better, Lee is doing well, i quite happy but let’s not act like its something its not.

Jefferson is not accurate

FACT: JJ’s .58 Comp% > JLee’s .55 Comp%

JLee is having a great year and bringing his average up, which was actually only .52 coming into this year – I wonder how much JJ would have improved….?

But let him ride the bench if he is reinstated..

Fat chance.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 21, 2011 8:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

So the criterion to give a flying rat about one of our players is if he is heisman material?

I said at the end of my comment that he got screwed and I hope he gets cleared. We all know it is a bunch of BS and the case will be thrown out. The state has nothing on him. My point was that instead of talking about the the the players that are actually playing you are talking about this. You have insisted that the state’s case has holes all in it, which I happen to agree with you. Let their case fall apart while you enjoy the football season and spend your time writing about the players on the field.

You’ve obviously never been on one.

U.S. Army (10th Mountain Division)
Administrative Segregation Sergeant (Louisiana Department of Corrections)
Don’t call me out personally if you don’t know me. I know a thing or two about being on a team.
You have know ideal that JJ wouldn’t be doing just as well as JLee or better, Lee is doing well, i quite happy but let’s not act like its something its not.

You are correct on this point. I don’t know how much JJ has improved since last season. My analysis of JJ is squarely from last season. I guess all my anger from last season has carried on into this one and until he shows improvement, those are the thoughts that will be burned into my mind.
FACT: JJ’s .58 Comp% > JLee’s .55 Comp%

I am gonna reply to this tomorrow as I don’t have the time to write a book tonight.
Fat chance.

I know he will get his hands on the ball and he will get plays designed specifically for him. I prefer a one quarterback system. I think it is better for the team to know who their leader is. I’m not confident in JJ’s leadership abilities from what I have seen in person and on television.

If you can't beat them, arrange to have them beaten-George Carlin

by AcquiredPanic on Sep 21, 2011 9:13 PM CDT up reply actions  

SouthernMan has his views

and anyone who SLIGHTLY differs is a racist, or has never been on a team, or is a schmuck. Personally I agree with what you say, I think 3 articles in 6 days is a little much, we get the point, and everyone here agrees Jefferson is getting screwed by the PD.

by Squash on Sep 22, 2011 2:19 AM CDT up reply actions  

SouthernMan has his views and anyone who SLIGHTLY differs is a racist

This is where you show your true colors.

I have never called anybody a racist you LYING piece of crap.

One of you guys tried to read something into one of my post, which had absolutely nothing to do with race and I have never written anything remotely involving anyone’s race so YOU are the race baiting, lying hypocrite and you seem to be stalking me.

Is that you Mr. Lowery?

Get a life and go bother someone else.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 22, 2011 6:46 AM CDT up reply actions  

Using deductive reasoning

Right here you are calling not only me, but the majority of the fan base racist.

Let me apologize to the many good, decent and rational LSU fans (not you Squash) that permeate this board for what I am about to type.

LSU fans are the WORST fan base on the planet. We suck, we eat our own, we’d rather a young man go to Angola KNOWING he has been falsely accused just because we THINK the other guy would be better on the field.

“I have never called anybody a racist.”

It seems like you called almost an entire fan base racist, “you LYING piece of crap.”

by Squash on Sep 22, 2011 9:34 AM CDT up reply actions  

It seems like you called almost an entire fan base racist

Where is race even remotely related to anything written there?

Once again, honesty is not a strong suit for you, we get it.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 22, 2011 10:22 AM CDT up reply actions  

"Where is race even remotely related to anything written there?"

Are you serious?? Accusing the fan base of wanting a young black man to go to Angola has NO racial message at all? Are you seriously trying to say that?

Not to mention, the whole Angola thing was first put out by Billy, haha another great writing tactic; just steal someone else’s line and put it out as your own.

by Squash on Sep 22, 2011 11:33 AM CDT up reply actions  

Holy H W freaking Billy Cannon

Where did I bring his race into anything, you small minded jerk?

AGAIN, there have been many tiger fans to express the sentiment that they are happy about this because it keeps Jefferson off the field. The result of a prosecution for felony battery could end in prison time, you make the connection.

And are you now calling Billy a racist for mentioning Angola?

I have NEVER (nor has Billy) described him as a young black man, you did and it is SO FREAKING irrelevant to this it is not funny.

Stop being a prick, you were and are WRONG about JJ lying, and YOU are flat out making stuff up about me, get a life.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 22, 2011 11:52 AM CDT up reply actions  

Ok

I will admit I was wrong about Angola. I don’t live in Louisiana, and so didn’t know that was the name of a prison. I thought (I think understandably) that you were saying we should send him back to Angola the COUNTRY, as in send him back to Africa, which WOULD be extremely racist.

So I take back the racist comment. I’m gonna reply to your comment below up here:

It is not baseless, libelous, or false to quote a newspaper article. The quote in question has never been contested. I have not yet seen the link you are referencing where it says he left after it started. If you would like to post that, that’s fine, I’ll read it and reconsider.

Honestly I’m sick of arguing like this (not the debate, but the name calling) haha so I’ll stop correcting your spelling, etc. You just stop accusing me of having an agenda (I don’t know what it would even be…I support JJ, I was just trying to be objective) and spreading malicious rumors and we’re good. We’re on the same team here. I apologize for letting this get out of hand. It just seemed to me like you overreacted and started accusing me, and so in turn I also overreacted.

by Squash on Sep 22, 2011 12:31 PM CDT up reply actions  

I apologize for letting this get out of hand. It just seemed to me like you overreacted and started accusing me, and so in turn I also overreacted.

I have to applaud you Squash on trying to be civil even though you and SouthernMan have obviously had your differences. This is never the case on any of the message boards I post on. It is nice to see someone step up and try to make peace. I always try to remember that we are all rooting for the same team and in the end, we all want the same outcome.(Although, sometimes it is extremely hard to do, lol) I would rather take out my anger on opposing teams and fans than people I consider an extension of my family.

If you can't beat them, arrange to have them beaten-George Carlin

by AcquiredPanic on Sep 22, 2011 1:07 PM CDT up reply actions  

I thought (I think understandably) that you were saying we should send him back to Angola the COUNTRY, as in send him back to Africa

OMG, you can’t be serious? Really? I mean really?

So I take back the racist comment

It’s called race baiting, you did it.

Honestly I’m sick of arguing like this

Then stop doing it, just say “I’m sorry, I was wrong” and move on.

I support JJ

By calling him a liar?

I was just trying to be objective

Nice try, not.

We’re on the same team here

How would I know? Most of my teammates had/have my back, its part of the deal.

I apologize for letting this get out of hand

Fair enough, I’m done.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 22, 2011 1:08 PM CDT up reply actions  

Yes really

I’ve never heard of the prison Angola, but I’ve heard of the country, and that would be in line with something racists might say.

Everybody lies, I don’t JJ’s a bad person, but I think lots of times when people do something even a little wrong, they overreact and deny everything initially.

I don’t know how I wasn’t being objective…

You tell me to say sorry and move on earlier in your comment, and then you later quote me as doing just that…but whatever, it’s fine.

by Squash on Sep 22, 2011 1:20 PM CDT up reply actions  

OK Squash

We just need some honesty here buddy, and I’ll be done with it.

Do you really want us to believe that you thought I was talking about the country as to say “back” to Africa, when I never said “back” at all and who ever heard of the term “back to Angola” as opposed to “Back to Africa”?

Moreover, you accuse me of “stealing the Angola line from Billy anyway” essentially alleging plagiarism on my part, which would be absolutely ludicrous if you thought I was talking about ‘back to Africa’ or you would have compared me to the KKK, not Billy Gomilla.

‘Everybody lies’ now? Sorry not good enough – you were accusing JJ of lying to his coach and therefore saying he deserved his suspension even if he isn’t guilty of the charges.

You didn’t make the apology until the end, but then you seem to want to keep it going.

Just admit the TRUTH, you spread rumors about JJ because you were either misled but then refused to admit you were wrong OR you have an agenda.

Just admit the TRUTH, you falsely accused me of racism (among other things) when in reality it is YOU that were race baiting.

I’ll forgive you, it’s ok but you need to tell yourself the truth.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 22, 2011 2:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Lol

Yes, haha I really was. I feel kind of dumb about being that far off, although I guess I shouldn’t expect to know all the names of prisons. Why the heck is it named after the country anyways? And yeah I know you never specifically said “back” but put in context to what I thought, that’s the message it conveyed to me.

Lol again, about stealing Billy’s line, I thought Billy was making a joke about how extreme some racists were…ok let’s just move on from the Angola thing, shall we? Haha it’s embarrassing.

I’ll admit I falsely accused you of racism, but again that was due to me not understanding what you meant.

The bottom line on my JJ view: he’s getting screwed by the legal system, I could see that (IF the newspaper report that I’ve been talking about is accurate) him lying to Miles’ office originally could’ve been grounds for his suspension (could’ve been, not saying should’ve, just saying Miles could claim that and it would be reasonable), I don’t BLAME him for panicking and just blatantly denying knowing anything about it (again, IF the quote is correct, I still haven’t been able to access the other links), and regardless if Miles is using that as the basis (don’t think he is, but saying he could make that argument) or if it’s the legal system…it’s about time for JJ to be back. He’s been suspended plenty long enough.

I definitely don’t have an agenda, I legitimately like JJ as a player on the field and off.

Yeah this whole thing was kind of stupid and got out of control, I’ve followed this blog FOREVER but just recently joined, and I have usually sided with you and your optimistic views of the team (during the dark days of 08 especially haha).

by Squash on Sep 23, 2011 1:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

Ok

I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt.

If you give it to JJ and stop qualifying the rumor by justifying the accusation. There is no evidence he lied, so unless something disproves his version of events he should not be accused of it.

Deal?

I legitimately like JJ as a player on the field and off

Me too, I think he’s earned it.

I’ve followed this blog FOREVER but just recently joined

Welcome.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 23, 2011 5:43 AM CDT up reply actions  

You are correct on this point. I don’t know how much JJ has improved since last season.

And thanks to the BRPD and a Lying piece of Garbage we haven’t had an opportunity to find out.

I guess all my anger from last season has carried on into this one.

Just curious, were you angry at JJ during the back half of the season? I just remembered that he seemed to improve a bunch down the stretch, as did JLee….

and until he shows improvement

Hard to do from home

I prefer a one quarterback system

So do I, but Les used it last year to help them both get comfortable and improve and I think the change of OC with an actual QB coach is monumental for us in terms of QB development moving forward.

So perhaps, just maybe we shouldn’t place ALL of our past failures squarely on JJ’s shoulders, he was thrown to the wolves just like JLee and has endured just as much, now even more with this BS and maybe could use the support of his TEAM (which I believe he has) and its FANS!

That’s all I’m saying.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 22, 2011 6:33 AM CDT up reply actions  

“You have know ideal that JJ wouldn’t be doing just as well as JLee or better, Lee is doing well, i quite happy but let’s not act like its something its not.”

Only 4 grammatical errors in one sentence, glad to see improvement from such a fine writer as yourself, SouthernMan.

by Squash on Sep 22, 2011 2:20 AM CDT up reply actions  

Perhaps you (Squash) should just stop with the personal attacks on SouthernMan. You should be able to have this discussion without such tactics.

by Geauxst22 on Sep 22, 2011 8:59 AM CDT up reply actions  

I would love to

And I do with every other poster on this site. You can feel free to go back through our conversations and see who initiated the aggressiveness, me or SouthernMan. Also, I have tried to be the peacemaker several times and offer ways out. But if he’s accusing me of lying and “spreading malicious rumors” I’m going to defend myself.

Not to mention someone disagreed with him and his first response was “you’ve obviously never been on a team.” He is incapable of staying rational in his discussions, and that’s the definition of a personal attack right there. Again, check all the rest of my posts with other members of this site and see if I have any personal attacks. And if correcting spelling is the worst personal attack I have, I could do much worse.

by Squash on Sep 22, 2011 9:40 AM CDT up reply actions  

“He is incapable of staying rational in his discussions, and that’s the definition of a personal attack right there.”

Ummm, not really …

by Geauxst22 on Sep 22, 2011 9:46 AM CDT up reply actions  

Again, check all the rest of my posts with other members of this site and see if I have any personal attacks.

Perhaps you should reread my original remark. I only referenced your personal attacks on SouthernMan.

by Geauxst22 on Sep 22, 2011 9:55 AM CDT up reply actions  

True

I’m just saying I responded (which I probably shouldn’t have done), but I certainly didn’t initiate. Also, I was trying to say that his accusation of AcquiredPanic never being on a team was the definition of a personal attack.

by Squash on Sep 22, 2011 10:01 AM CDT up reply actions  

You’re really not understanding what I’m trying telling you in as simple of terms as possible so I’m just going to stop.

Have a great day!

by Geauxst22 on Sep 22, 2011 10:05 AM CDT up reply actions  

That's what I've been thinking

this whole article, and during the ensuing comments. Calling someone a liar and a rumor spreader is a personal attack. That was you, doing it first.

by Squash on Sep 22, 2011 11:30 AM CDT up reply actions  

Squash

you’ve been nit-picking and basically calling me an idiot for two weeks now and it started in the first JJ article I published.

Then in this thread you have been putting forward a baseless ATTACK on JJ by calling him a liar for an incomplete statement that is three times removed from the actual words that may or may not have come out of JJs mouth.

The fact is that in the ONE conversation, albeit reported in separate articles on separate days JJ allegedly said to his father “I don’t know anything about the fight” AND “I was there when the fight was breaking out and I tried to get some of my guys away from it, then I left”

Putting those two statements that were uttered in the same conversation, again albeit not fully quoted in the first report, one would assume what he meant by “I don’t know anything about the fight” was ‘I don’t have any ideal who was fighting and why, but it wasn’t me!’

That is consistent with what his attorney(s) has said from day one and it is consistent with TWENTY-Five or so SWORN witness statements, including EIGHTEEN Football players. So, unless you were present for the phone call and know for certian that JJ said something other than what has been fully reported then YOU are just putting forward a libelous rumor out of some selfish crappy agenda.

At least that’s my humble opinion.

GEAUX TIGERS!!!

by SouthernMan on Sep 22, 2011 12:15 PM CDT up reply actions  

Well . . .

 . . ., according to Les Miles, et al, he WAS THE TOP QUARTERBACK on the team prior to the arrest. He was the starter. He won the job. Yes, there are a lot of people who never accepted JJ as the starting QB of this team, for whatever reasons. I happen to disagree with your opinions across the board as to whether the team is better or worse off without him. That’s one reason it’s being discussed; because “a lot of LSU fans I know” think JJ is by far the superior choice.

More important, however (and this is “an LSU topic”), is the demonstration of how a kid’s life can be ruined by an incompetent police force and a university which, at least in my opinion, didn’t have the stones to stand up and say “this is BS. This kid is innocent until proven guilty and we’re going to treat him as innocent until proven guilty. We don’t care if we’re already under the NCAA microscope for past transgressions. We’re not going to throw an INNOCENT kid (at least in our system of justice) under the bus to cover our own butts.”

Is that enough of an “LSU topic” to justify this discussion in your mind?

by Deluded on Sep 20, 2011 4:56 PM CDT reply actions  

incompetent police force and a university which, at least in my opinion, didn’t have the stones to stand up and say "this is BS. This kid is innocent until proven guilty and we’re going to treat him as innocent until proven guilty.

I agree with this completely. I live in Baton Rouge and this is the rule and not the exception here.

If you can't beat them, arrange to have them beaten-George Carlin

by AcquiredPanic on Sep 20, 2011 5:18 PM CDT up reply actions  

I don't think Miles can do much here.

Remember – we’re on NCAA probation. If he lets them back on and they somehow are convicted, who knows what the NCAA will say / do? The NCAA has no burden of proof or the like – they basically do whatever they want, however they want ( see Miami players taking money getting a 1 game suspension yet RS gets 6, knocked down to 3, for basically being honest ).

That said, the BRPD / DA needs to be called out in a big way. Sadly, this is the sort of thing most anyone in BR expects from both parties – complete incompetence. Attention needs to be brought to the ridiculous job the BRPD and DA’s office have done in this case and most every other one. I’m tired of them making up their minds on who’s guilty or innocent despite witnesses and evidence, refusing to acknowledge witnesses or evidence, running the town how they see fit, while almost daily the news is about another murder / rape / arson / whatever. Baton Rouge needs to be cleaned up, starting right there.

by Xanathol on Sep 21, 2011 4:23 PM CDT reply actions  

I agree with this also

I spend a lot of time downtown at the courthouse for matters related to my job. If people only knew how much time and money was spent on absolutely nothing. BRPD seems to charge everyone with anything they can regardless of evidence. I laugh to myself (as quietly as I can) in the courtroom because a large amount of cases are either thrown out completely due to lack of evidence or charges are reduced as low as they can go. I have a degree in CJ. One of the first lessons was “Never say or do anything without being willing to defend your actions in court.” I don’t know why this doesn’t apply to BRPD and why officers are never held accountable for it. What a lot of people don’t know is that their is a stat system within law enforcement. The more arrest you have, the more pats on the back you get and promotions are more easily secured. Felony arrest are also a plus. This is why they will try to charge you with anything and everything. It is Criminal Justice fantasy football.

If you can't beat them, arrange to have them beaten-George Carlin

by AcquiredPanic on Sep 21, 2011 6:05 PM CDT up reply actions  

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